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Daniel: Hello and welcome to another episode of the You Should Talk to Podcast. I am Daniel Wiener, your host. You should talk to pairs, brands and marketers for free with vetted agencies because finding great agencies is a pain in the ass. Today I'm super excited to be joined by Josh Martin, who is Director of Social Media and Community Management at Church's Texas Chicken for a few months now.

Is that right, Josh? Yeah, two months. Love it. Well, that's, uh, hopefully, so far so good. Yeah, it's been great. Awesome. Well, we will dive right in. Uh, my favorite question to kick off, what's an unpopular opinion you have in, usually I ask in the marketing world, but we'll keep it, uh, to social since I, I don't get to talk to social professionals every day.

What's your unpopular opinion in the social media world? 

Josh: Oh, man. Great question. I thought about this quite a bit of which way I could take it. Sure. I, I think, um, just a general theme. I think [00:02:00] brands in the space could be lazy. Um, and ex one example, I mean by that is it's always a, a pet peeve of mine is, is what I call matching luggage.

So in social content, um, you know, creating one piece of content and just basically putting the same content copy on all the channels. Um, you know, I, I, I'm a big believer in each channel should be approached differently. So, uh, you know, my probably hot take is, you know, I think it's lazy when we take one piece of content and we're putting on Facebook.

Instagram, TikTok threads Twitter, and now, now we've got like almost 10 channels, right? And it's sure you produce all this work and then you take that one video and you apply it everywhere. Um, so that's, that's always a big stickler with me. I, I, I love to think about each channel and how do you use it and how they're different and trying to spread 'em out versus it all being kind of the same.

Are 

Daniel: you a big fan of repurposing content for different, or you think it [00:03:00] should have? I guess my question, I talked to, you know, brands a decent amount about this. Do you think, you know, uh, for brands who have, uh, all the budget in the world, maybe it's different. I'm curious for a, you know, maybe a budget strapped, uh, company.

Like what's your recommendation there for how to get the most out of individual channels? 

Josh: Yeah, I'm all, I mean all about, I know it, it takes a lot to, to create content and you spend a lot of time, money, and effort, um, creating it. I think the biggest thing is, is just change it up a little bit. It could be simple as changing copy, right?

Or sure tweaking here or shortening the video here. Um, no, I'm all about repurposing content, but, you know, tweak it up a little bit so you look like you, you know, looked at the channel and tried to fit, you know, the right, you know, piece of content to the right content, um, you know, so that the audience, you know, can react to it and hopefully in a 

Daniel: positive way.

Love it. Uh, you've had an interesting set of experiences leading you up to now, I'd say you started at agency and then a ton of, uh, [00:04:00] big food brands got Arby's, Buffalo Wild Wings, Papa John's, and now churches. Tell us a little bit about that and then I'm particularly, uh, interested in what you're seeing just in the social landscape in general at the moment.

Yeah. Um, a very 

Josh: unconventional route in the space. Um, actually. I went to school for, I'm a master's in industrial, uh, psychology. Um, probably makes you better 

Daniel: at understanding social 

Josh: well. Yeah, I think. I think so. You know, so social is all about understanding how people react to things. Um, I. And, and so, uh, coming out of grad school, the job market for, you know, what I went to school for wasn't that great.

And, um, there was an opportunity to, you know, work at an ad agency right out of the gate, um, and, you know, decided to jump in there and really fell in love with. With marketing and, and agency and, you know, being able to, um, help clients do different things and being exposed to different things, um, and kind of fell into social.

[00:05:00] Um, right around 2008 when social was kind of just, you know, picking up for brands. Uh, back then it was all about Facebook pages. I remember first clients I worked on was creating, remember we used to have tabs for different Facebook pages that you'd create, and that was kinda my first ro into it. Um, so was able to get a lot of experience and really taught myself at, at an agency, you know, social.

'cause back then there was now there school, you could go to school and have classes and there's so programs on social media marketing, which is great. Sure. Um, but really just taught myself and, and, you know, learn from other. Um, people, um, you know, I remember doing Twitter views with folks back when, you know, you do these Twitter interviews and learn about, um, different approaches to social.

Um, Twitter was a little 

Daniel: different back 

Josh: then. Yeah, a lot different. Um, yeah. And then decided, you know, I, I could take this to the brand side. Um, at the time. You know, Arby's was hiring a social media manager and thought, Hey, I've got some [00:06:00] good experience here and lemme throw my hat in. And was, was able to get it.

And from there, um, have been in food service most of my career. Um, it's an exciting space. Um, you know, it's a lot of fun. Food is fun. Um, there's a lot of creativity in the space, um, and, and just have kind of bounced around to do some really great spots and been really fortunate to work with really some great people in the, in 

Daniel: the space.

What do you see in social in general at the moment? I'll, I'll, you know, uh, tie it into the next question I have of, uh, you know, what's your best piece of advice to other leaders out there about how to, how to win on social in 2025? I'm, I'm curious in food in particular, uh, you know, the, the question or the, I guess the problem I hear from CMOs often around socials, how do we stand out in the sea of sameness?

You know, there's, you know, 20 million different options for, for lunch, for dinner, for breakfast, all that sort of stuff. Do you have any advice for folks trying to stand out on social. 

Josh: Yeah. I mean, when it comes to standing out, it's, it's immensely hard [00:07:00] now. Um, I think that's 

Daniel: a fair answer. 

Josh: Um, it it, there's so many brands that are on their game.

Right. Um, you know, 10 years ago, you know, we only had a few channels. Right. Facebook, Twitter, and then Instagram was coming around now. Sure. Um, the space has changed quite a bit and there's so many brands that have brought in their own talent, you know, hiring people. Um, internally to run social, whereas 10, 15 years ago when I started out, we, it was all agency supported and even some brands were, was reluctant to jump in social media.

Now it's, it's table stakes. Every brand has a, has a social media team. Every brand works with these great agencies to help create content. So there's just a vast amount of content. So it is, it's harder to stand out. Um, and I think. Now it's, it's, it's almost like you have to be, and that's where I struggle sometimes in, in the space, is you've gotta be the most extreme cases of content.

You know, there's like, you know, people like beefs, people like [00:08:00] the, the really wacky ideas and social right. And that's what ends up standing out. Um, but trends now it's, it's all about video, right? That we're in this TikTok, um, generation where it's it's short form video. And people, if it's not interesting, they're scrolling, right?

They, they, they can sit on TikTok. I mean, I do it right every night. I'm sitting there and scrolling through countless videos, and if in the first few seconds it's, if it doesn't interest me, boom, I'm scrolling. So you have such a short amount of time to capture somebody's attention. Um, so I think that's where it's.

You know, I'm always about like, what are some insights that can really drive creative content that resonate with the audience? That's the stuff that's gonna stick out. Um, and so it's, it's immensely important, I think, to think through your strategy and create content that's gonna resonate. Um. Because there's just a lot of sea of sameness.

Like, like I said, everybody's just scrolling through and it's hard, it's very hard to 

Daniel: stand out. Do you think, I'm curious, are you thinking of, you know, um, [00:09:00] staying true to the brand versus unhinged content to, to try to stand out, you know, is that like a constant thing flowing through your mind when you're thinking of, you know, how, how to do that?

Josh: Yeah, it's tough. Um, you know, the balance is. And I get stuck at it too sometimes. I think a lot of brands in social media marketers, we have fomo, right? You know, we see these brands that are out there, the Nutter butters, it's kind of weird wacky space, right? And like, oh man, that's what's getting attention.

So we need to be doing that, but it may not be the right thing for your brand. Um, so. You know, I have a little bit of love hate relationship with the, the extreme because I feel like that's all that gets attention. But there's a l still a lot of brands doing great creative, smart social that's resonating with the, their audience that's tied to a strategy that's really de developed in the voice.

Um, and, uh, hopefully, we'll, we'll start to see more of those stories get covered versus it just being, you know, the, what, whatever's the most extreme that it gets kind of [00:10:00] talked about, um, in, in the spaces right. 

Daniel: Do any brands come to mind that you think are, you know, killing it on social at the moment outside of, you know, Nutter Butter or Duolingo gets a ton of press and stuff like that.

Can you think of any smaller brands that are doing well? Um, not a 

Josh: lot of small, I mean, smaller bes are tough to break through, but I, I mean, I mean QSR, so you know, the, the Taco Bells, McDonald's, the worlds are very solid, very consistent. Chili's has been a great story, I think, um, a great comeback. Um, yeah, it's, and.

And, and sometimes people think that's just a fly by night, but I think if you've followed them, this has been years in the making. Right? Um, and I, I think it's all an overlook. Um, a lot of these brands that do really well, you're building a foundation, you're building your audience over time, right? Um, but what I really love about Chili's.

Is, it's based on an insight, right? You know, they're, they're out there saying like, fast food is almost as expensive as what they're running, right? And they're pushing against that, um, in their [00:11:00] content. And then obviously I think they've had a little bit of lightning in a bottle with some of their, uh, menu items with the cheese pulls and having influences and cra come into the building and experience that.

Um, and it's kind of snowballed from there. But once you kind of have that momentum, all the content activations that you do, just. You know, are out there and doing really well. So again, they've probably laid a lot of foundation over the last few years, but once you get some of those kind of quick wins, I think it really, um, you know, they rise to the top.

Daniel: Yeah. No, I, I agree. Um, you know, you mentioned most brands who are doing well on social have, you know, a combination generally of in-house folks, but a lot are, you know, relying on agencies to create, uh, hopefully scroll stopping content. Uh, I'm curious, like, what's your opinion of. The best way for a brand to engage an agency with social, it's a little bit of a trust thing.

I would argue. You know, social is the closest you get to your customer, so it's not something, I think I started in social media as well, uh, oddly enough, back in 2008 and it was. [00:12:00] You know, when I think of the fact that they, I worked for a, a automotive retailer, so managing like the Facebook and Twitter accounts for 80, uh, car dealerships.

Oh, wow. When I think of the trust that they put in me to do that, knowing nothing about anything going on at the dealerships and all of this stuff, now I'm like, oh my God, what am miss? That was, you know, and an opportunity. It was the beginning. Hearing all that, I'm curious, like what do you, how do you think a brand should engage with an agency?

You know, there's some that outsource it entirely. There's content, there's community management. How do you, how do you think through that? 

Josh: Yeah, great question. I'm a big believer in, uh, brands having somebody internally at, at the controls for their social channels, right. I mean, what, who's better, who's gonna know better than somebody internally that lives and breathes the brand and can understand all the insights and the outs of the business and understand the customers and be able to move quickly?

Um, so I'm a big believer in, in building that internal team, that internal foundation of a team that can manage [00:13:00] social channels. But I'm also a really big believer in agencies. I think I, I'm, I'm a big believer in a combination of both. Um, you know, I like having some internal folks that are, are smart and in the space, but also like having that power that the, that agencies can bring to the table, right.

That different way of thinking, you know, pushing us. Um, so to me the sweet spot is, is having a really strong agency team that gets social, that has social, um, native creators, um. You know, the a a person that can understand creative for social is very important and can move at the speed of light. Um, it's immensely, um, important now than, than especially.

You know, 10 years ago when we thought we had to move fast and now it's even quicker. Yeah. Because stuff so it moves so fast within even less than 24 hours, you know, trends are gone. Um, and you may have missed your mark. So Longwinded answer to say, I, I love a combination of both. I, I, the best situations I've been in is where we've had a really strong internal team and partnered with [00:14:00] a really strong, um, you know, agency that has, is, is known for creating social first content.

And as long as we're all on the same page with. You know, strategy, trust, and communication. That's been, that's been the best recipe for success that I've had. 

Daniel: Yeah, I, I've seen a big shift since COVID in agency land in general. I saw it a little bit before when I was at an agency of, you know, big name brands moving towards smaller, specialized agencies who, you know, do one or two things really, really well.

I think social has always been a little bit of a unique, um, ask I get in my world. Uh. I find at least there were, it's a service that so many agencies like didn't do and then were bolted on. Right? Like, they were like, oh, social, you know, years ago social's becoming big, like we should do social now. Um, do you have an opinion of like full service versus specialized agencies?

You know, social first creative is an ask I get every 20 minutes it seems like. Uh, and I think it is a unique. You know, skillset, [00:15:00] somebody who understands social. Uh, and I know a lot of full service agencies say, yeah, we do, we do social incredibly well. And you know, fewer agencies these days are just social 'cause they've done the same thing as well and said, oh well we need to offer other things.

How do you think about that? 

Josh: Yeah, I mean, I, I love the specialized agencies. I mean, you think about it, when you go to the doctor, you, you know, you have a general practitioner, but when you, when you think of something, when you have something wrong, you go to specialists. Right? So to me, why wouldn't we think that way?

A little bit about agencies, um, you know, obviously sometimes budgets run in, that's probably the biggest hurdle is, is, you know, you only have so much budget to go around. Sure. And so a lot of it ends up going to your standard a OR. Right. Um, but I, I, the, the challenges AORs have, they spend so much time on the traditional.

Um, you know, with tv, um, and print and all these other things that social has still kind of taken a backseat. It's, it's still deprioritized in their focus. And so I think that's where you run into [00:16:00] challenges of, of if they were allowed to spend more time on it and focus on it, they could probably deliver better content.

So I think that's where, you know, we, we tend to, to get frustrated with the AORs just because of just how it's all been set up. Um, but if, if, if I had my preferences, I would, I would love to. You know, bring in more specialized agencies, um, you know, for social, um, you know, I've worked with an agency that just did TikTok videos for us.

Sure. Um, there's agency out there just help with influencers. Right. Um, that are really, um, have smart, talented people that, that they live and breathe that, um, 'cause that's what, as what I do as a practitioner, I live and breathe social every day. So I wanna be able to work with people that are, are thinking the same thing I do and be on the same page.

So the situations I've been in, it's been where we've pulled in. Um, specialized social agencies and that's worked the best. And, and if they can work really well with the other agencies in the roster, right, where you, your pr, your, your media and your traditional ir, you can have some really great, [00:17:00] um, work because everybody's bringing their strengths to the table.

Um, and, and when they can all work together in, in harmony, that's, that's when you, I think you, you create award-winning work. 

Daniel: Yeah, you kind of alluded to, or kind of already answered the next question. I was gonna say, can you think of a, you know, a great agency experience? I'm always particularly interested in what made it great.

You know, I, my, I don't know if it's a hot take. Uh, one of my hot takes is, you know, the work, uh, doesn't matter. Uh, and of course I don't mean the work doesn't actually matter, but, uh, I never hear that when I hear that in, or very rarely I should say, in terms of like what made an agency experience. Great.

Uh, I'm curious, can you think of. A great experience you've had in the past and what made it great. 

Josh: Yeah, and I alluded to a little bit before, it's, it's making sure, and like with any relationship, it's, it's, it's trust, it's commun clear communication, um, uh, and, and clear strategy and direction. Like, I think it, it's a two way street.

Um, you know, sometimes [00:18:00] agencies get the finger pointed at 'em, but, and um, sometimes it could just be. You know, on the brand side, you know, not, not giving clear direction or not having clear, um, you know, instruction of around strategy and approach. Um, but the best situation I've been in is, is when we've, you know, like I said, had clear strategy and direction, but also, um, you know, the, the leaders on both sides, just letting the, the people do the work.

Um, the best situation I've been in is where we've had on the agency side, a really strong account slash strategists. Great copywriter, great creative for social. And then on my side, my team, um, you know, uh, uh, me leading social and a couple social media managers, the community managers. And just like I said, let us cook, right, as long as we're very clear on the strategy and the direction where we're going.

You know, let us make magic. and I've had one situation where. We were able to do that and it worked. We created award-winning work. and the leadership [00:19:00] trusted us. We didn't get a lot of leaders, our leadership on the brand side getting the weeds and same on the agency side. And it was, it was a beautiful thing.

Um, and some of them always continued to try to chase. 'cause it's hard. there's a lot of cooks in the kitchen and, if you're not aligned on the strategy or if you're not aligned on the trust between the two, it can be challenging. 

Daniel: I was gonna say, I think trust, uh, is you, you're, uh, underappreciated, especially at a big brand level that's got a ton of eyeballs on it.

'cause there is no time to, you know, run things through. You know, a ton of approvals and things like that. To your point, if you're trying to take advantage of a trend or something, especially on that front, you know, you've got 20 minutes to, uh, to get something out sometimes. So having leadership that trusts both teams to do their thing, um, yeah, I think is super crucial.

Josh: I, yeah, and the, I've talked about this before. The best moment I've had at, at Arby's was the Pharrell Tweet right back in 2014. You know, we built a, a great relationship with our legal team. Uh, our team had [00:20:00] trust. This was a Sunday night, uh, the, the Grammys were happening. Um, and if we had not done those things to build that trust, that tweet doesn't happen.

If that tweet doesn't happen, you know, Arby's doesn't see Sure. You know, $50 million of, of media coverage that we got in that moment. So, um, yeah. It's crazy. 

Daniel: Yeah. I'm curious if you can think of a bad agency experience you've had on the flip side and what made it not so, uh, not so great. 

Josh: Yeah, and it's, it's the same kind of thing.

I don't, I don't think there was a, a, a great level of trust between, um, our internal team and the, the team that was working with our agency. Um, you know, in this situation, I, I, I don't, this, the struggle I had was that the agency I felt like just didn't listen to us, our internal team. Um, and, um, I think any great relationship.

With an agency, you know, revolves respect and, um, look, I, I, I know I, I'd love agencies to fight for ideas and fight for, uh, what they [00:21:00] believe is right, but there's gotta be a, a point where, you know, we can kind of move on and, and get past those situations. Um, so probably the worst one was just where I felt like they weren't, they weren't, they weren't listening to us.

They would just, or they basically weren't hearing us. They would listen us out, but they weren't hearing what we were saying. Um, and then the work suffered. Um, and we're just constantly in this battle of just not being on the same page. 

Daniel: Um, so yeah, that makes total sense. Uh, to go back to the Pharrell tweet, I'm just curious, you know, that that's a moment in time like people strive for in the, in the social landscape and stuff like that.

Just quickly, what, what was that like, like being in involved in that and just seeing, you know, the, the snowball effect after that? 

Josh: Yeah, it was a very surreal and wild ride and I tell people, um, you know, it was. It was a great moment to be a part of, to have something really positive happen for the brand.

Um, that we were able to ride that momentum for almost an entire year. Um, [00:22:00] you know, but I, I, I mentioned to people it, it wasn't just like this happened and that was it. It was, 'cause I'd been in the brand for three years at that point and it was, um, laying the foundation of. Being great at community management, building a great relationship with our legal team.

You know, I, I tell people social is you're playing the long game as much as the short game. So every day matters of the things that you're doing, engaging your audience, creating that engagement so that when you have a moment like that, um. And authenticity gets thrown out quite a bit in our space. But in that moment, we had the right to be in that trend.

It was an authentic moment for the brand to jump into. And everybody responded in that way, right? Um, only only Arby's could respond the way we did in that moment. And that's what sparked that great reaction that we got out of it. Um, and obviously it's a little bit of lightning in a bottle winning the lottery in that moment because of what had happened.

Um, but I, I tell people a lot of times it's, it's laying that foundation. [00:23:00] Um, you know, I, I, I think in, in our category, we can chase trends quite a bit. Um, and there's a, a FOMO happens quite a bit now, um, where I feel like, you know, practitioners that are managing for brands feel like every day, oh man, we gotta, we gotta try to jump on something that, so it, they get dragged 

Daniel: in the comments.

Yeah. I feel like if they jump on a trend that doesn't really like apply to them and try to like, make it their own or something, or comment on something to try to interject themselves. Yeah. Especially on TikTok. 

Josh: Oh yeah. Yeah. And I fall in that trap too, right? So it's hard. I'll sit here on, on Monday and be like, oh man, what, what can, what's happening today?

You know, the Tony's happened last night. Oh, could we, should we do something? Yeah. You, you kind of have that kind of, um, I don't know if it's anxiety, but it's just like that, a little bit of pressure of, of trying to always create, um, you know, a meaningful moment for the brand you're working on. Um, but oftentimes it's, it's, you know, I, I, I say like, you know, it's better to find the right moment to strike.

I. Um, that, that can create the most [00:24:00] impact for you. 

Daniel: Yeah, no, I like it. Uh, that's, that's a, that's an awesome, uh, you know, uh, thing to be able to put on your resume. 

Josh: Yeah. I always say at least I didn't do something that got me in trouble, that, that is true. Which is, which is always, uh, could be a scary part.

So, yeah. 

Daniel: What are, uh, what are you most excited about in the marketing space or social space in general at the moment? Uh, I 

Josh: mean, AI is, is, is very interesting to me. Um, you know, the chat, GPD, the things you could do with that is, is incredible. Um, you think it's 

Daniel: having a net positive on social At the moment, I'm, I'm most active on LinkedIn where I'm extremely active and AI comments and, uh, I care less about AI content.

The comments are just, I don't know, insane on some of these things. I'm, I'm curious if you think AI is having a, a net positive effect on social at the moment. 

Josh: Yeah, I, I don't know. It, it, it's, it's probably hit or miss, you know, I think the people that are doing it the right way can be positive, but obviously there's, there's, it's, it could be abused like with [00:25:00] anything, like any trend, um, in the space.

Um, but I'm, I'm really interesting to, uh, to see if, especially from a, you know, um. Creating content perspective. Um, there's, there's companies out there that can help us create videos much quicker, images much quicker, and just how things move fast. It's, it's just how quickly you can create something. So I think done in the right way.

Um, it, it, you know, it, it can be effective. It'll be interesting to see if there's any parameters that'll get put on it or how people will view it moving forward. Right. Um, so I think we're still kind of in this phase of figuring it out a little bit. Um, so that's, 

Daniel: have you, have you watched Mountain Head yet on, uh, no.

No. Do you know what that is? No. 

Josh: No. 

Daniel: Mountain Head just came out with Steve Corre, um, and a couple other, uh, I can't think of who else, uh, the actors are, but it's a satirical movie about a bunch of tech billionaires and, uh, ai, uh, I won't spoil it for you. We call it AI deep fakes on socials, like a big part of it and stuff like that.

So I was curious if, uh, if you had seen that yet. No, but [00:26:00] it's very satirical and ridiculous. But also you're like, oh, that could like actually kind of happen and stuff, so 

Josh: that's interesting. I'll check it out. 

Daniel: You should, um, to that point, what, what keeps you up at night, uh, or stresses you out from a, a business or social standpoint currently?

Josh: Oh, man. You know, I, I, I, I think, you know, the, the fear of missing a moment is really big. Um, you know, for me, um, you know, missing an opportunity for us to, to jump on something timely, just knowing how fast trends move. Um, so every day I'm constantly thinking of, of ways to jump on something. 'cause you just never know what could take off.

Um, there's so much content out there. Um, so, but it, it's hard. There's, I mean, there's, I mean, I'm hearing, I'm looking at, for our, for our brand, I'm looking at keywords on, on Twitter threads. You know, mentions on Facebook, mentions on Instagram, TikTok, there's so many things that are trend on TikTok and, and there's so many different things.

Ways weighs in, I think as, um, could be [00:27:00] creatively to create content. Um, so my biggest thing is I, uh, hey, I don't wanna miss a moment that could be creative, impactful. 'cause I've been a part of a moment that was hugely impactful Sure. For my career, for, for the brand I was working on. Um, and so as I'm always working for any brand, I'm always thinking of, of of all the moments it could be, um, or ways in and, and.

You know, you don't wanna spend too much time of analysis paralysis, but, um, you know, that's the biggest thing is, is just having people, obviously paying attention to different things or looking at ways to, to jump on content or jump on opportunities is, is often helpful. But that's what usually keeps me up at night is, is if something happened, there's related to my brand overnight and, and we missed a moment to, to create impact.

Is, is, is what? What sticks with me most often. 

Daniel: Do you think of it? I'm just curious from like a missing a moment standpoint, do you think of it? That feels like very macro, which I totally agree. That would scare me too. Do you think of it from like the micro, I mean, I think food is, [00:28:00] uh, uniquely positioned where you can influence the bottom line on a day-to-day basis.

If you get a couple people to change their, you know, their lunch decision to, to go to your, uh, you know, your brand and stuff like that. Do you think of it at that level? 

Josh: Yeah, I. Yeah. Um, and I always spend a few moments every day of engaging with the community. Um, you know, every, every little interaction could turn into something, right?

I, you know, and you stack those up over time. Um, like I said, in social, you're playing the short game as much as you're playing the long game, right? Yeah. It's the whole sales overnight brand over time. Right. We're, we're, we can drive immediate sales by a quick interaction. Um, and then some of the things they're doing from a branding perspective or just tone and copy and the creative you're putting out, you're playing kind of the long game, right?

Um, so yeah, wearing both of those hats, um. You know, I often, you probably often take a micro for granted and maybe some brands do. Um, but having a team in place to be able to have those micro interactions, um, uh, are immensely important. I think that, like I said, it [00:29:00] helps you as the long game, right? So when you do have that big moment, you've got, you've built a, hopefully a coalition of fans that you have already engaged with your stuff.

And so when they see that big piece of content or, or, or moment, you know, they're there to, you know. Help you with your reach, right? And 

Daniel: interacting with it. I love it. I think it's great advice to not, uh, not overlook the, uh, the small moments. Uh, we'll finish with a couple fun ones here. What was your very first job?

Josh: Uh, very first job. Um, I grew up on a golf course. Um, I grew up in a small town on a public course, so I was, I, I worked at the golf course from 15 to 18, putting up golf carts. 

Daniel: I always ask, do you think it makes you, uh, you know, provided any insight or makes you better at your job today? 

Josh: Uh, yeah, I mean, I think just how I interacted with people.

I was exposed at a very young age to a, to an older audience and um, um. Golfers are very entertaining and fun and have personality. Um, so just in my just day-to-day, you know, interacting with people and, um, that respect factor and trust, you know, golf [00:30:00] is, you know, a, a game of, um, you know, respect and, and trust.

And so I think that has definitely made me who I am and, and how I've, you know, hopefully approached how I've worked with, you know, people in, in, in the brand side as well as agencies. 

Daniel: Nice. Uh, if you weren't allowed to have churches, what would your final meal be? 

Josh: Oh, well, um, I mean, I, I grew up in a small town, so I'm soul food kind of guy, so, um, this has been a, a fun brand to work on.

So, um, I, I love, you know, soul food, fried chicken, fried okra, cream corn. Okay. Mac and cheese, that's a, that's a heavy final meal. You know, you gotta go out pretty, pretty big. Right. That's what I, that's what I'm 

Daniel: saying. I, I'm, and yeah. Love it. My final question, who's somebody who inspires you personally, professionally, or both?

Josh: Oh, man. Um, you may know him. Uh, uh, I, my first job right outta college was at, at agency Spun Logic, and, um, Jeff Meyer led the [00:31:00] agency. Yeah. Um, and, and so I was just, I always been in awe with his approach and how you could pivot, um, the way he approached business. You know, very, very purpose-driven, uh, leadership style.

Um, and, and just over the years, he's, he's gone on to, you know, you know, take on many other businesses and startups and just that mind, that creative mindset that he has, I always respected and appreciated and the drive he has to, um, to do different things and, and, and yeah, he's a machine. It's, it's impressive to watch.

So, um, he was always something, somebody that I always thought, man, that that's, I, I'd love how he approached the work. Very positive, glass, half full kind of approach. And that's how I try to approach, you know, people on my team and people I've worked with is, at the end of the day, especially in, in QSR, we're, we're just, it's food.

It should be fun, right? Sure. We're, we're trying to sell food, which is, which is something that's awesome. So 

Daniel: I agree. No good to have those people, especially at your first job. Uh, I presume you'd like everybody to follow [00:32:00] churches across, uh, social channels. Is there any new menu items or promotions or anything you'd like to, uh, you know, drive, uh, viewership to.

Josh: Yeah, that'd, uh, that'd be great. Um, yeah, we're coming back with a, a smokehouse chicken, uh, product that's, that's coming out in a couple weeks, so it's, it's actually a half chicken. Um, so normally we fry chicken, but this one is, we put a rub on it. Oh, nice. Um, it's one of those things that our fans have been clamming or for us to bring back.

Um, so we're bringing it back for the summer, uh, starting at the end of June, which is exciting. 

Daniel: Awesome. 

Josh: Well, 

Daniel: I appreciate you joining. This was awesome. And yeah, we will chat with you soon. Awesome. Thank you.

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