Daniel: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the You Should Talk To podcast. I am your host, Daniel Wiener. You Should Talk To pairs brands and marketers for free with vetted agencies because finding great agencies is an enormous pain in the ass, especially in 2026 and beyond. I see you're already shaking your head and agreeing with me.

We love it. Super [00:01:00] excited today to be joined by Sristi Honda, who is the VP Marketing of Dave's Hot Chicken, and this is your first podcast ever.

Srishti: Yeah, it

Daniel: I love it. We're- You're gonna crush it. This is gonna be... When you do 100 of these, this will be your first, and you'll have to tell everybody after about this first experience. 

Srishti: Yeah, I tattooed it on my arm today so that it's commemorated

Daniel: that's so crazy that we already have a matching tattoo, so we're off to a good start. Uh, we'll jump right in. What is an unpopular opinion or a hot take you have in the marketing world?

Srishti: Okay. I've-- So I've been on this diatribe for a bit, but I think... I, I know there's-- I know AI has a lot of like benefits, and I know that it has a lot of, uh, use cases, but I do think that we have, as a, as a nation, as an industry, we have a lot of FOMO. And so a lot of it is, you know, it's almost aspirational, like what do you want AI to be?

It's not quite there yet, but everybody's like touting, [00:02:00] you know, we've got, you know, my veg- my arugula has AI now. And it's like, what the hell are you talking about? Like, everything can't have AI. And so it's also... It's sort of like, in a way, the blind leading the blind. It's very useful for writing an email where you, you know, sound like an asshole, but then you ask it to tone it down.

That's really great. I, I see a lot of benefit there. But I feel like, you know, there's, there's a lot of like, you have to be on this train, and if you're not on this train, it's bankruptcy like tomorrow for your business. And so I think we need to be a little more intentional, but also understand that, you know, your output is only as good as your input.

Daniel: So you still have to do a lot of that thinking work. You can't just expect, you know... And I'm not gonna name names, but you can't ex- any of these to be doing the thinking or the, that, that heavy lift for you. so many people have told me, "Oh, you've gotta use AI. How are you using AI?" And I go, "I'm not." And I-- They go, "You [00:03:00] have to." I go, "Great. For what? Like, tell me what I should be..." And nobody really has a good answer for

Srishti: Hey, doll

Daniel: in my own business. I'm sure there are wonderful applications, but yeah, I haven't, uh, I run a very successful business that is, uh, at the moment, AI, AI-free, so

Srishti: Yeah, I've read proudly. Yeah, it just, it really, you know, blows my mind sometimes when it's like, or you get somebody's, uh, you know, deck and it's like, well, if I wanted a 15-pager on what this was about, I would've just done it myself. Like, what is... You st- it's just word poop

Daniel: I'm w- you can say shit. You can say it. I, I told- we already said you can say whatever you want on this podcast. I, I'll give you a perfect example. I've posted virtually every single day on LinkedIn for the last, I don't know, six years. I, I, I hate myself more and more every day. Uh, yesterday I had a post, uh, perform reasonably well, and I woke up to a comment that was so clearly AI.

It was literally just my post regurgitated. And I, one, I didn't have the heart to do it to the person to write, [00:04:00] like, "Thank you so much for the comment. I, I agree so much that I wrote the post you're, you're commenting on about the post." Like, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a weird, uh, time out there. But yeah, you, you mentioned like proudly AI free.

It's not even proudly. If somebody could give me an, a use case where I'm like using it and it has this grand effect on my business, I'm, I'm happy to, uh, to implement it. But yeah, I haven't, uh... Well, I'll, I'll change up a little here. Are you using it in any capacity in, at Dave's at the moment?

Srishti: Like I said, when I write an email where I'm very steamed about something, then I tell it to, like, tone it down. It helps me keep my job, which is great. Uh, and obviously I'm being a little facetious. I do think that there is a lot of FOMO around it. I think there's a lot of, you know... Th- there's not a whole lot of clarity for a lot of people, and I think businesses are just trying to...

You're, you're told, like, if you're not AI, then you're nothing. And so, you know, when you have vendors just, like, [00:05:00] constantly shoving AI down your throat, that's very, uh, annoying. But I do think that obviously there are cases. I love using AI sometimes to, you know, kind of come up with an idea and pressure test it and, like, play both sides, and it's sort of like you, you already know going in what your thinking is, but it really helps sometimes create parameters or clarify or, you know...

And, and not from the perspective of, like, I know my idea's the best and, like, AI just tell me, like, it's a self-fulfilling sort of thing. So it is really helpful to be like a thinking buddy in that sense, where you're not wasting somebody else's time and it helps you sort of like, uh, clarify a little more how you're thinking it, uh, which I, which I really think has benefits to it

Daniel: Maybe I'll, maybe I'll, uh, find a, a use case to be an AI host of this podcast. I won't even have to show up anymore,

Srishti: That's right

Daniel: we'll dive into your background a little. You've had quite the, uh, the journey and set of experiences. I see a lot of food. I see a [00:06:00] founder. I see a PR agency. Uh, and now Dave's coming up on five years, which in 2026 is a trillion years.

Uh, you don't, you don't, you don't hear it.

Srishti: Yeah, call it body or yeah, it is, uh,

Daniel: Yeah, tell us a little about, you know, your journey. You know, and I'm always particularly interested in hearing, especially around food, I think food's such an interesting space, just what you've seen in terms of consumer behavior, uh, evolving in, you know, over the course of your career.

But I'm always particular with food in a post-COVID world 'cause I work a lot with, uh, I'll just call it big franchise food and QSR and yeah, it's a, it's a wild and difficult space, uh, for brands to, uh, stand out, and Dave certainly has, uh, achieved that

Srishti: It is. I think, you know, it's-- Well, that's, it's a broader, it's a very broad question. Um, answering the portion about my experience, it's, I think that stems sort of from the ADHD portion of it. Like, it's just, that's where you, that's where I wanted to be in everything all at once, all [00:07:00] the time. I

Daniel: Diagnosed or undiagnosed?

Srishti: Well, diagnosed, so, so, so I can proudly say it, that authentically ADHD.

Um, but it's, it's, you know, when I started my journey, I actually, I did my undergrad in political science. I really thought I would go to law school and work at the ICJ or something, or the UN. That was my ultimate... So selling chicken is, you know, basically

Daniel: say basically the UN, you know?

Srishti: It's basically, uh, it's, it's very peace... You know, it's-- Chicken is the kind of protein that everybody enjoys, so it kind of is.

It's like the Switzerland of protein. But we, uh, you know, I... But very early on, I worked in rural India with the Packard Foundation, which is like the Hewlett-Packard, Packard arm. And so they do a lot of public health, so I thought public health would also be part of my, you know, resume. But at some point I was like, "Well, you can always work-- you can always go back to working for [00:08:00] nonprofits.

Like, why don't you challenge yourself to understand the business world a little bit?" Because my family doesn't come from a business background. Like my father was a diplomat, my mom was a teacher, so it's kind of like th- it's never been... So I, you know, I started in PR 'cause I had no and I was like, "Well, this seems business adjacent.

I know words. I can write. Maybe that's all it takes." And so, you know, food's always, food's always been at the center of... It's-- I love food, so it's always... I remember inventing like sandwiches when I was a kid, and I'd put like ramen in them, so I was one of the OGs for that, and try and get my brother to eat it, and he'd be like, "I don't want it."

And I'd be like, "Just try it." So,

Daniel: You were destined for culinary

Srishti: so yeah. So I don't cook, but I enjoy food, and so I started my own, um... At one point I was working on a protein. I went vegetarian for a while. I was one of those people who would send emails to their friends saying stupid things like, "Meat your meat." And like, lost a lot of friends, [00:09:00] uh,

Daniel: Welcome back to the dark side if you're, if you're,

no longer 

Srishti: I, gained all my friends back, but you know, when I started this, I was working for this like, uh, South African company that does like soy protein, so like soy sausages, nuggets, all that. And the beauty of soy is it tastes like nothing. Chicken tastes like nothing, so really the flavoring, whatever. So I set that up in Singapore, uh, India, and Malaysia.

And then I was like, "Why don't I just start something of my own without like soy and make it healthier?" So I started a plant... It was, it was vegetarian and plant-based in certain, uh, SKUs. And I ran that in India for about five years or so. Lost everything, as, as one does. Uh, and then I was kind of like-

Daniel: what, what do you attribute that to?

Srishti: I think partly being too young, uh, and just not knowing enough about how to run a business and not, you know, surrounding myself with the kind of advisors that I should've.

Uh, I can say this now. And also in India, [00:10:00] like if it's a premium product, I think it was just too ahead of its time. So it was one of those where now everybody's doing beet root like cutlets, but I was the first one and I'm really proud. Like I know Starbucks in India does it, so I was like, "Okay, well I was right somewhere."

Daniel: That's quite the claim to fame

Srishti: but, but you know, yeah, when I saw it at Starbucks, I was like, "Okay, at least it's mainstream

Daniel: This is actually a surprise pocket. This is Shark Tank. I'd like to, I'd like to invest.

Srishti: The well I'm in, let's start it all over again. But yeah, so it, it, it just kind of becomes a little more, you know, uh, you... It's a premium product. It was too ahead of its time. You know, I think I was a super stubborn solopreneur, so I was very much of the opinion, like, it's my way or the highway, and not what the market's telling you.

Which, you know, you learn once the market beats you down over multiple years, you're like, "Okay, now I get it." And, and you can't really scale if the number of grocery chains that can create your product are, you know, are [00:11:00] limited. So you hit a ceiling fairly quickly, and then there's a fri- French fry company that starts with Mc and ends with Aines, uh, which was my biggest competitor.

They had just entered the Indian market. I'm not taking names obviously. And they had billions of dollars, and I was just one person, so they, I, they... I'm not joking when I say this, they'd hide my product. Like, they had an army of merchandisers who'd go in and, like, put their product. So all that. So it was a whole host of things, and it was fine.

Like, I don't think that kind of experience can... You can't get that ex- kind of experience anywhere else. But I think that also is kind of... It helps with future success because, you know, at that point I'd worked at a restaurant. I'd, you know, which had like an art gallery and all that. I did the menu pricing for them.

I did all these things, and I was really like, "Oh my God, I love food so much." It's, it's the one thing that brings me joy, and the thing that brings me joy about it, without sounding like hallelujah or preachy or [00:12:00] whatever, is really, uh, nothing excites me more than when I see somebody eating something that I've discovered and I really like.

There's just something so, like, pure and...

Daniel: we're kindred spirits. I'm the exact same. But I love to cook, so nothing gives me more joy than cooking for somebody and then saying, "Do you like it? Do you like it? Do you like it?"

Srishti: Yeah, like they make fun of me at work 'cause I'm like, "No, you must, you must try it." And so they say this all the time, but it's just, it brings so much joy, that discovery. Uh, and so I was like, you know, I really love food. I wanna be in food. I've always wanted to be food or food adjacent. And so when I moved to LA or the US both at the same time in 2019, it was two months before COVID, so fabulous

Daniel: good time to, uh, to start in a new country.

Srishti: Great, great time.

I was the only person I can say who was unaffected by lockdown and all that, 'cause I was still working for my job in India, so I worked all night and I'd sleep all day. So I was the one person who didn't gain like 50 pounds and, you know, and [00:13:00] get depressed with the lockdown. Because what can you do at like 3:00 a.m.?

Nothing. You can just work. So, uh, but then, you know, fairly quickly I was like, "Well, I need to find like a real job here." So I started working for a woman-led produce company 'cause that was the only company that was essentially hiring at that point. Uh, and so, you know, I was like, at least it's in the food space, and it was really interesting produce that's not like an apple, but like the, the woman who founded this company, it's called Frida's Produce.

She-- I never met her because she passed away like a few months before I started working there, but she passed away at 97 and she still worked there every single day, and she brought the kiwi fruit to the US. So she brought the kiwi, she brought-

Daniel: a, what a cl- what a... Man, my-- what, what a boring life I lead. I have got nothing like that

Srishti: Right. And, and so, you know, they had like exotic fruits and all that, and it was really fun. It was really, you know, I, I now know what a, the difference between a kumquat and a [00:14:00] loquat and a, you know, a, a bunch of other random things which nobody else knows, which is great for trivia night, but that's about it.

But then I, you know, I became obsessed with hot chicken during COVID, and there was a local like chain, not a chain, like it was a one-off, like they had a pop-up every weekend. It wasn't Dave's, but I became obsessed, and so my Friday afternoon or Friday evening meal was always this one place, and I was like, "Oh my God, I love hot chicken."

So I made it sort of like a side quest to start eating hot chicken all over LA, and I'm not even making this up. Like it was, it wasn't... And Dave's was nowhere in my like periphery. Like I had eaten at Dave's. I, I never imagined like I would work at Dave's. You missed

Daniel: missed the boat on being a TikTok influencer. Starting a, starting a hot chicken, uh, tour during COVID? I mean, that would've been, that would've killed

Srishti: was sleeping all, all day, so it didn't work out. But yeah, so I mean, you know, I was obsessed with [00:15:00] Hot Chicken. It was like the... It just opened my mind and I was like, "What is this fabulous, like, product?" And so when Dave's Hot Chicken was hiring, I immediately applied 'cause I was like, "What's the worst that'll happen?

They're obviously gonna reject me." And, you know, seven, uh, interviews later, I, I was working at Dave's. And I started when we were at store 20, which was kind of remarkable because it is sort of dog years. I've grown up with the brand. I really have. Like, I was a little, like, you know, wide-eyed, like, "What do I know?"

And so it's been phenomenal and it's been crazy, and obviously our growth has been crazy and it's, it's just... The, the first big learning of my life was when I ran my own business. The second big learning of my life has been running, uh, you know, working at Dave's and, like, doing some of the marketing and all that.

So it's been, it's been transformational for me for sure

Daniel: What's your biggest, uh, your biggest piece of advice based on all of what you just [00:16:00] said and, and learnings that you would give to other marketing leaders in 2026 and beyond about how to, uh, you know, achieve success?

Srishti: Honestly, it's, it's really boring, and I say this a lot, but I-- you just have to be consistent. And if you're just, if you're... I really do think that there's space for hard work, like real hard work, because you may not be the smartest, but if you're outworking everybody else, you end up at the same place. You really do.

And, and I know, you know, there comes a point like, and I'm trying to... It's an inflection point for me because I'm like, "Well, you should be letting go of some of this," and like, you know, more of the bigger picture stuff. But it really is a-- It's really hard for me to do that because I feel so obsessed and like invested in like every single piece of it.

Uh, but I really do think like if you're-- One of the things I read once which really made an impact on me, and I really, really stand by it, is the harder you work, the luckier you get. And it, it, [00:17:00] it really put ev- It just opened my eyes and I was like, "That's true." Like, you're making your own luck. And I think especially when you're starting out in your career, one of the things, and I still to this day in a way I do it, is I never say no to anything.

Daniel: Clear- clearly you're doing your first podcast right now from a cold LinkedIn message

Srishti: So you, you never know what's gonna happen. You never know what you're gonna learn. It might be the biggest waste of time, and I, and I don't mean it for like, don't be discerning about everything, but I just mean, like, if there's a project, like I'll, I'll do it. I'll... The worst thing that'll come out of it is I'll know not to do it again, right?

But the best thing that'll come out of it is that I'll pick up another piece of the business or another insight that I would've never known otherwise. And that honestly helps you become a better marketer or a better, like, just person in business because you're just able to... It's so important. I think all of us work in these like, you know, we're all [00:18:00] siloed off, right?

And if you're not talking to everybody, you're not able to see the overall impact and you're not able to make a bigger impact. Whereas if you're at least aware of all the pieces and you're able to put those together, I think it's so gratifying to be able to really see like the big impact that you can make

Daniel: I like it. Is there with, uh, you, you started at store 20. How many are there currently? What's the number today?

Srishti: We're at, this week we'll be at 442 stores

Daniel: Is there any moment you can think of, you know, closer to when you started of, you know, some sort of inflection point of, I don't know, a celebrity eating there, somebody posting a specific piece of content online? Like, what do you attribute the, meteoric rise to? Is there any one moment that stands out over others of like a clear inflection point of like, "Oh shit, we really got something here"?

'Cause there's, you know, to be fair, there's others who, uh, claim-- in the, in the hot chicken space and, you know, there's chicken in general. I'm just curious, is there one moment that [00:19:00] stands out above the rest?

Srishti: I think really it's, again, compounding moments. I think when you look at our social media, when you look at everything, it's that... And we always talk about this, we joke about it. It's when you take that first bite and the eyes roll to the back of your head moment, that's a moment that if you can scale, it's incredible.

Obviously, I think nobody goes into a business... It's, it's a lot like social media. If you're going in with the thought that this is gonna go viral, it won't, right? And, and I think because nobody expected it to be where it was, obviously everybody knew, like, the product is great, like, the marketing is great, you know, the, the, the team is phenomenal.

Bob's team is better than any in the world. But it's... Nobody went... It was just all the pieces came together just beautifully, and it's because I think all of us work like we're working towards something bigger than everybody. And I don't mean that in a preachy, bullshitty, like, kumbaya to- ty- type of way. [00:20:00] I really...

Like, every single person here is invested in an outcome for this business, and so you don't see that everywhere and it's... I think that's kind of the magic to it

Daniel: I love that. Uh, this is perhaps my most or my, uh, favorite portion of this, uh, conversation because I'm a wild animal on LinkedIn, uh, some days, clearly, since we're here. Most folks with your title, uh, I'll couple that with a brand that I would argue every agency on the planet would love to work with, every vendor on the planet would love to work with, and I think people just assume you're sitting at your desk with, you know, a, a stack of cash just ready to dole out to agencies and vendors.

Are you getting hit up 7,000 times a day everywhere by agencies and vendors?

Srishti: Yes, and I have, uh, the-- I guess I have the title of, uh... Because my CTO told me this the other day, and I was like, "Okay, well, it makes sense now," that in this company, I, I'm the second highest receiver of emails [00:21:00] which...

Daniel: But congrat-- Wow, what an honor

Srishti: what? What an honor. So of junk mail. Yes, people, it is crazy out there. I, I do think it's really...

It's, it's a little wild. I guess, you know, I've said, "Take a chance, and don't say no to anything," so I guess that's how everybody operates on LinkedIn currently. But it's really... I guess we're all the same. We're like, "You know what? If you don't try, you're not gonna be successful." Uh,

Daniel: there are better ways of

Srishti: there are way better ways, and I think it is, it is nothing short of spam.

And I think... I, I also think, you know, the biggest difference between me wanting to talk to someone and me... Number one, try and understand the brand. Don't just, like, mass reach out and be like, "You know what? You guys could use this for your social 'cause your social sucks." But you're not-- You haven't taken a look at our social.

You don't know. If we have seven million followers, are you saying that it's bad? Like, what are you base-basing that on? Or, you know, like any hundred of other, like, [00:22:00] different cold calls or things that we have. So I think you... 

Daniel: Don't, don't call your baby ugly either, you know?

Srishti: it

Daniel: Not a, not a good strategy in my

Srishti: good. We should. I, I think it's great. We should have co- hard conversations.

There's nothing wrong with that. But I think

Daniel: From strangers? I'm actually curious 'cause I know that a lot of agencies lead with that. We look-- We think this sucks. X, Y... I feel like

Srishti: Yeah,

Daniel: it doesn't land from a stranger 'cause I'm like

Srishti: Well, if you're into carrot land, but I feel the reason it--

Daniel: That's, that's

Srishti: Like, oh my

Daniel: a thera- you should be a therapist. This is

Srishti: God. Like, oh no. But I feel like what happens is that they're not being thoughtful about it. They're just like, "You know what? I have 30 cold leads that I have to follow this month. Let me just send another email, and another email, and another email."

My secret now, and I don't know if I should give it away, is that my-- And it makes me sound like an asshole, so this is the fourth time I'm saying this today, but I just write unsubscribe back

Daniel: I love writing remove.

Srishti: Yeah

Daniel: [00:23:00] thing is when they write, "Remove from what?" And I'm like, "Come on." Like

Srishti: Yeah, don't, don't play that game. Like, you know what you did. So I just think it's really dishonest, and I think it's, it's, it's-- And again, it's mostly AI written, and it's like, "Yes, I get it.Just leave me alone

Daniel: So then I'm curious because you will, I can say with 100% certainty and we'll laugh about it now, but eventually you'll get pissed off. You will 100% for the next, I'm not joking you, five years, you will get some sort of cold message referencing this podcast once it goes live. I'm being 100% serious. It happens every day.

I'll get a text from friends who have been on so far in the future, "Oh, we saw you did the 'You Should Talk To' podcast." Like, and then they try to sell something. Clearly AI picked it up with, you know, SEO or AEO or anything like that. So I'm curious, is there anything if you are not in market, I'll give you the answer I think.

I think the answer is no, even when people tell me yes. But if you are not in market for a solution, is there anything a vendor can say to like, for you to take a general call short of somebody rec- somebody you know recommending something? "Uh, I think it [00:24:00] makes sense for you to chat with them about X, Y, and Z."

Just cold. Is there anything somebody can say?

Srishti: Well, because I hate the, like, clever cold opens and all that bullshit. Like, I, I, it's, we- I think we're all going through the same thing, so I don't know why these vendors and agencies aren't doing a better job of just being like, "Let me figure out how to actually build a meaningful relationship." I have...

There are some vendors who we've, you know, we've never worked with. I have the best relationship with them, not because we haven't worked with

Daniel: That's good. For now, until you work with, you're like, "Man, they suck. I

Srishti: Yeah.

Daniel: these people now."

Srishti: Also kind of bullshit. But I think the thing that makes it, it's just a genuinely nice relationship. It's also really r- r- comforting because if you're at a conference, I'm not the most like, you know, open and like, you know, b- like a party animal type of... I'm very introverted, but it's really nice when at least you see one person who's kind of a familiar face and it's kind of like, "You know what?

Thank you for just being here." So, so [00:25:00] maybe all of them can start coming up to me. Uh, please don't. I, I mean it. Do not.

Daniel: I'm gonna have to make a disclaimer for this podcast when we go-- when this thing

Srishti: Do not. Please do not. The worst, the worst, the worst of all is when they call you. It's like I have never-- How dare you call me? I, I, I don't know what to do, like when they call me and I'm, I'm not being bratty. I'm not being... I understand, like you, if I didn't work at Dave's, you wouldn't ever call me, right?

So I get it. Like I understand it's from a-

Daniel: So that's, that's the shitty part because what I hear from folks in your role, which I actually do think is shitty, and it also just makes me think people don't play the game well. The second if you, God forbid, lost your job or

Srishti: You died.

Daniel: something and you want to play, they all stop. No one, no one calls anymore, which I'm like, play the game a little bit better.

Like, at least feign excitement in the, uh, the middle ground. You don't get asked to speak anymore. You don't get all-- You know, it's, it's insane to

Srishti: Nothing. It all just dried up. So, so, and I understand that. I understand it's a place of privilege. Like tomorrow, if I didn't have this job for whatever reason, [00:26:00] nobody would call me, which is fine. Don't call me then. Just don't call me. I've, I've resorted to telling people that I'm gonna report them to the police.

For what? I don't know

Daniel: That's the 100% the name of this episode. Please do not call me. I have to come up with it for the thumbnail, so that's 100% the name of this

Srishti: Just don't call. Like, you can-- Let me be the filter, right? Like, why are you calling me and saying like, "Oh, I saw your blah, blah, blah," and you don't know my... You-- It's, it's just laziness. You haven't researched the business. You don't know anything about the business. It's not hard to do that. You can easily, if you're using fucking AI for everything else, use it for good.

And, and just, you know... So, and I, again, I have to say, I'm not being bratty when I say this. I understand I'm very privileged because of my job and everything, but just, it's good, I think, common sense for all of us when we're just making cold calls

Daniel: I love it. This is [00:27:00] gonna be the be- we should have smoked cigarettes on this episode, made it like "Mad Men" style, like back in the day, just slugging, uh, slugging liquor at, uh, you know, noon and for lunch with a bunch of cigarettes, chain smoking. There you go. I don't know what's in that cup. Um, I'm curious, I've seen since COVID a little bit of a, a... I don't know, I guess originally I saw agents or brands, especially with names, you know, big name brands, which I'll lump you guys into, moving more towards smaller, independent, often specialized agencies. I've now seen the pendulum shift back, 'cause brands are asking me for it more, to more integrated agencies who do, uh, kind of the full spectrum-y.

I'll just lump creative and media together. They want to see more, uh, you know, hand-holding and kumbaya between the two, uh, practices. What are you-- How do you think of your agency landscape at Daves or just in general? You know, small, independent, you know, holdcos. What's, what's your, uh, your cup of tea?

Srishti: I [00:28:00] think it-- for every brand, it depends on where they are in their life cycle. I think everybody also... I think most brands sort of go through this where if something isn't going right, it's like, well, the first line of defense is let's get a new agency, right? Or let's rebrand it or let's do one of these things

Daniel: Uh, the rebrand

Srishti: which feels like, which feels like you have a sense of control, but you, you know, because that's the only thing you can sort of control at that point.

I- is that the right thing? No. I think from... I think-- So I think it goes both ways. I think agencies need to understand that a brand is coming to you for a solution, right? You cannot give them a one-size-fits-all solution. If you're doing that, it's much like the telemarketers or salespeople. It's just a blanket sort of approach.

That's not gonna take you that far, right? Because eventually there's gonna be frustration on both sides, and it's gonna be from the perspective of like, "I'm asking you for help. I'm not receiving it." [00:29:00] So I think there, there's no right answer to what an agency can or cannot do or what s- what, what size of an agency you should go for.

I think it really just depends on, again, the input. The output is only as good as the input, right? And so you still have to take ownership of what it is that you're trying to define. You still have to understand what the clear objective behind getting an agency on board is, and you still have to give them direction.

And I think we often forget that we're asking them for help, but nobody knows the business better than you and I, who are in the business. And so the agency also needs that kind of feedback loop a little bit, which sometimes it's, it cannot be a set it and forget it relationship, right? Where you're like, "It's on autopilot.

Let's hope for the best." So I think at the... And this is just based on my experience, so I can't obviously generalize, but I think a good relationship with an agency has to be based on how you sort of [00:30:00] shape that relationship and then sort of also make it clear in terms of the expectation. And then if it is like here's a, you know, canned whatever solution for you, then at that point you probably know whether it is what you seek or whether it's not what you seek.

So I've said a lot of words without really answering the question

Daniel: You answered the question. I'll, I'll phrase it in a different way 'cause I'm always curious 'cause my, you know, hot take of sorts, which people freak out over at agencies often, and I work with hundreds of them, uh, is I say, "The work doesn't matter." And then I... When they gasp, I go, "Wait, wait, wait, wait. Uh, I know the work matters.

Of course, the work matters. It's what you're getting hired for." But I just see every single day, you don't get to do the work if you haven't mastered, like, the 7,000 other things that come first. And whenever I'm helping a brand find a new agency, my first question is always, "Well, what's going on with the current agency, and what went wrong?"

And all of that sort of stuff. And 99.9% of the time, it is never the work first. It's never, "The work is terrible. Everything else is great, and, like, [00:31:00] we just need better work." It's, to your point, all the things you said: expectations, or, "They don't really get us. They don't seem to give a shit." You know? Like, all of these things, which is why, like, I then go to my other unpopular opinion sometimes of like, you can be such a successful agency doing, like, pretty good work.

Non, like, groundbreaking... Like, not every brand, you know, needs the, uh, the, the Mercedes, you know, of, of agency work. They just need a bunch of stuff and probably, like, a quick timeline with a smile on your face, and you act like you give a shit about the business and, like, their success and stuff. So I'll phrase it in that realm.

Do you-- Does that scare you? And you're going, "Danny, oh my God. What are you talking about?"

Srishti: Not at all. I think, I mean, I agree with you 100%. I think it's also-- Again, that's why I said nobody knows your brand better than you do. You cannot go to an outsider and be like, "Hey, give me an idea." You can, you can lead them in a direction, but I, I don't think, [00:32:00] I don't... And maybe it depends on, you know, brand to brand.

Maybe if you're, like, in pharma, you need an agency to come in and help you make it a little more exciting and interesting or whatever. But, but I think you as the driver of that agency relationship needs to have a very clear understanding of what it is you're trying to extract from them. And by extract, I don't mean, like, you know, wring them till you can't get anything else.

But it's what do you want out of it? What are you trying to get? I understand there are certain things like, let's say it's a media agency. I don't know anything about media. I don't know how to run this. I don't know how to, you know, flight this. I don't know any of those things, so I look to the agency to help with that.

But I do think that, you know, I can't ask them like, "Oh, what's a good creative I can run on media?" That's the wrong question to be asking. So, so I think you have to at least have a general understanding, and you have to have a deep understanding of your business, 'cause [00:33:00] nobody else can do it. Otherwise, why would you hire an agency?

Daniel: I don't disagree. I think it's interesting in that example, because my mind went first to a media agency. Even if they don't do their own creative, they should have an opinion on

Srishti: No, no, they can. But what I mean is they can't be-- they-- you cannot go to them as the first sort of like, "Hey, give me your opinion on this." You can obviously, you know, pr- pressure test and do all those things with them, but it can't be that I need you to also help me with this. Unless that's what you kind of, you know, scoped out or whatever

Daniel: Your media agency just breathed a sigh of relief somewhere if they're, if they're, if they're listening in on this, 'cause they're like, "Oh, thank God. Is she gonna ask us about creative?"

Srishti: We love our media agency, so it's done.

Daniel: What'd you say?

Srishti: I love our media agency, so it's next to that

Daniel: You should... That, this is perfect, then we'll go right into... I was gonna ask you, uh, a negative agency experience first, but I'll ask you about a positive agency experience.

And I'm really particular in one thing. What makes... It could be that relationship or otherwise, what has [00:34:00] made a positive agency experience for you in the past? What makes it something you would say is positive?

Srishti: I-- the one thing I value in most relationships is the figure out ableness. So if you can, even if you don't know the answer, but you're willing to figure it out with us, I think that's really valuable. I think if you're straight away like, "Oh, no, that's not within the scope," then it's cool. We, we understand that now it's a very, like, rigid and based on just money.

Whereas I think that might be short-term thinking if you think about it, because like, if you are really the one person who's helping everybody figure it out, even if it's not in scope, next time, surprise, surprise, it will be in scope. You know what I mean? And so-- and, and it could just be, you know, obviously, I think there's a dime a dozen agencies for a dime a dozen things.

At this point, it's all fractured. It's all like, "We can do this," and, "We're very specialized," and... But [00:35:00] what you're not taking into account is that the person who has to make that decision also has decision fatigue for having to make like 50,000 other decisions. If you could just make it easier for them to make one less decision, that's gonna go such a long way, 'cause like the last thing I wanna sit there is figure out, like, "How do I do this now?"

You know? And, and I don't wanna read through your emails, and I don't wanna read through your deck, not because I'm lazy, but because we're all overwhelmed. Because now we're being hit up on our phones and text and, you know, emails and Zoom and all these things. It's like, take one decision away from me and watch how that compounds into, like, better outcomes for everyone.

Daniel: When I talk to agencies often about, like, if I had to pick one quality for them to be masters of or during a process, like how they win, it's making your life easier is the answer. Uh, making everything easier, making it easy to say yes, all of those things. Uh, so I, uh, I love that answer. I totally agree.

Srishti: Well, [00:36:00] and thank you for sending me all the answers ahead of time

Daniel: I wish. That would've made this, uh, you know, a lot easier. No, I think it's, it's interesting because to me, like agencies lead so much, I have to just remind them, you mentioned, you know, a dime a dozen, and I have to remind them like there's 100,000 plus, uh, companies in the US alone that identify as an agency.

You know, that's everywhere from one person, you know, solo people who claim they're an agency up to, you know, holdcos, all that sort of stuff. Uh, the average brand when doing an agency search, you know, I'll take out the mega ones that are, you know, if you've got $100 trillion in media, you're gonna talk to, I don't know, 50 to start maybe during an RFI.

But like normal brands are talking to like five or six agencies, you know, to-- during their process and you're, you're in the room. If, if you don't, if you don't make everything as easy as possible, uh, somebody else will. Like it's a competition for better or worse, and I have to [00:37:00] remind agencies of that all the time when they push.

And I'm all for like being deeply respectful of agencies' brain power and their time and their energy and all of that sort of stuff. But like some of the things I see agencies decide to push back on, I always find to be very particularly interesting. I'm like, "That's the hill you, you chose to, to, to die on?"

Like, or you didn't pick up the phone. That's my other whole thing of like them doing stuff over email. You hate being called, so I won't tell them to call you. But yeah, like people don't enjoy-- People are scared to pick up the phone, uh, these days, I find, so

Srishti: No, and the, the-- I know I, um, I hate picking up the phone when it's a cold call, but I do, I do agree that you can, instead of 50 emails flying back and forth, just one call can fix all of it, and it could take five minutes. We'll be one, and it'll be out of our system. But this obsession with like, you know, "Oh, let's find time on the calendar."

Like, fuck, just pick up the phone. Let's just... It, it'll take three minutes. I'm not, I don't, [00:38:00] I'm not gonna talk to you about your like, you know, past trauma or something. I just want

Daniel: That's good

Srishti: the answer. That's it

Daniel: We'll do that after this. Once we stop recording, we can, we can trauma dump. That's good. Tell me about a really shitty experience you've had in the past with an agency then

Srishti: I don't think we've had... Honestly, no. Uh,

Daniel: Everybody's gotta have something. Make one up, make one up. That, that doesn't play well for this podcast. What, are you kidding?

Srishti: No. Okay, so when I was in PR, and obviously I was on the agency side, but we had a shitty client. 

Daniel: I'll take that 

Srishti: nothing could be worse than a shitty client in PR when you are trying your best and you're like, you know... And he used to... I remember, I still remember to this day, he would call us if there was one negati- first of all, your business was...

So maybe the problem lies with you. No amount of PR can fix a bad business, and if you, and if the founder is, like, constantly in the news for the wrong things, we can't fix that. [00:39:00] And so to call on, like, a Saturday morning or a Sunday afternoon and, like, scream at the entire team and tell them that, "I'm gonna replace all of you, and you guys are robots, and you're idiots," and like, I...

And he, I don't, I don't know how. And, and he, I, I know for a fact that it was really, this is juicy, he, he was also getting kickbacks. So, so 

Daniel: Ay-yay-yay. This is the best podcast episode. Let's name... Fuck it. Let's burn the whole thing down. Let's name all the names. Let's name everybody

Srishti: So, but this was in India, so you guys can't trace it.

Daniel: Okay, that's good

Srishti: So, but it was just, it was crazy. It's like it goes both ways. You can't treat an agency like a piece of shit either, right? So, so, and I think that's why I kind of when... Because I've been on both sides, I kind of, you know, can sympathize a little bit. But it's just, bad experiences are, again, either you've outgrown each other, and it's not a bad experience, it's just that you are no longer able to meet each [00:40:00] other's needs, right?

And which is fine

Daniel: that's a very diplomatic, uh, answer to that. Maybe you should be a therapist. That was like the Mel Robbins there, the let them. You're like, "Let them." The agency missed their deadline, let them, you know?

Srishti: But you know what? Th- we're just not, we're not together anymore. We're not there

Daniel: Yeah. Um, what are you most excited-- Or since you already-- we already had our AI conversation, I know it's not that. What are you most, uh, bullish on or excited about in the marketing space at the moment?

Srishti: I think what's really exciting, and I think this is obviously because of the TikTokification of everything, people are really, really dying for in real life experiences. Like, everybody wants, like, after all that, like, you still want something in person. And I think it's really exciting because the opportunity to be able to do some really fun, even if it's not groundbreaking, just fun, community building driven like that, you know, it's, it's, there's just so much opportunity.

And if you can be really wild [00:41:00] about it, we've done a few things in the past which have been really fun and silly and, you know, whatever, very on brand for us, and I think people just enjoy that. So I think it's really, really nice to be able to overlay it with some sort of like IRL experience

Daniel: That's great. What keeps you up at night or stresses you out? From a marketing or business standpoint, not the, not the personal route.

Srishti: Oh, that was easier

Daniel: I was gonna say, yeah

Srishti: No, I think, you know, especially in the restaurant space currently, it is-- And I think that's true for everybody, so it's not... But I'm just saying it 'cause this is my industry. But it's hyper-competitive. There's, there's an intense race to the bottom as far as, you know, discounting and things go.

Uh, people are not feeling super positive about anything in the world right now. And so, you know, that obviously has a little bit of a... Not a little, it has a big impact on overall spending and things like that. So I think, [00:42:00] um, I think those, those kind of factors, just the uncertainty around everything, uh, and, you know, how, how can you break out of that funk for your consumer and for your customer is, I think, a great challenge, but it is a challenge

Daniel: I love it. We will, uh, we'll finish with some fun ones, and I have the, my, my favorite, uh, meal question. I better get a good answer, so you can start thinking about that, uh, that now. What was your very first job, though?

Srishti: My very first job

Daniel: Yeah

Srishti: was at my uncle's law firm. I was 16 interning there, and it was the most boring because it was, it was... He, he specializes in like anti-dumping law, which is basically like China dumping ball bearings into the market and like it's... At, at 16 I was like, "Wow, I, I don't know if I wanna go to law school."

So

Daniel: good outcome then if you, if you [00:43:00] landed at Dave's Hot Chicken, which sounds substantially more, uh, more appealing than anti-dumping, uh, litigation

Srishti: Home shopping is really boring

Daniel: The best question we'll have during this podcast, what would your final meal be? Not if it-- and it can't be Dave's since that's the too diplomatic of an answer

Srishti: My final meal would have to be like chocolate cake. And I'll tell you, there's this place... Okay, so we were...

Daniel: the Matilda route

Srishti: It is the Mat- it is like Matilda cake. There's this bakery in the UK, and I think he has two locations, one in Leeds and one in Manchester. We were in Manchester in February. It was like my Mecca, 'cause I was like, I told the entire team, I was like, "Guys, if, if you wanna leave without me, go right ahead.

There's just one thing I need to do, 'cause I'm, I'm at my like, you know, temple, if you will." Everybody walked with me. It was like one of those kids in a candy shop. I ordered everything on the menu. I... The cake is like 10 pounds, and it's like 20 [00:44:00] layers. It is the most magnificent cake. It went with me to every single, like, we went all over the country.

Uh, and four days, that one cake traveled with me everywhere, 'cause there's no way you can finish it, but it is so delightful. I didn't have the heart to throw it away. And I remember we went back to the restaurant, and everybody brought out a spoon. I don't know if you remember that Friends episode or where the cheesecake falls, and they just come out with spoons, and they all like just start eating it.

But it always reminds me of that because like everybody just came out with a spoon, and I was like, "You guys, you have to try this. It's gonna change your life." So

Daniel: you don't want any savory food before this if it's your final meal? You don't want sushi or a steak, you just wanna go straight for dessert?

Srishti: Just drink

Daniel: That's a first on this podcast.

Srishti: Well,

Daniel: Normally I get a f- a five-course, uh, dining experience. You said, "I don't want any of it. I just want this cake." What's the name of the bakery?

I wanna look it up.

Srishti: called Get Baked.

Daniel: Get Baked?

Srishti: yeah, and the cake is called the Big Bertha.

Daniel: Okay. [00:45:00] Okay.

Srishti: It's so good

Daniel: All right. Get Baked, the Big Bertha. Okay, I'll

Srishti: Yeah. It is memorable beyond belief. Like, but yeah, chocolate cake would be my last meal, and there's no question about it

Daniel: Okay. Um, my final question. Who is somebody who inspires you personally, professionally, or both?

Srishti: So this is where I always get stuck with these kind of questions, 'cause I don't know, I feel

Daniel: Are people asking you this question just off the street, who inspires you? I'm, I'm unoriginal

Srishti: Y- you know what? Nelson Mandela. Just

Daniel: Ah, so yeah

Srishti: Really in- he's inspirational. Everybody... I alwa- I ca- I hate answering these questions because it feels so absolute, and I just like... Y- you never know, like every... There's, there's people's work ethic that inspires me that I see. There's people's, you know, sense of humor that inspires me, and I, I feel like I would like that.

I know it sounds like a really bland and like

Daniel: Yeah, give me something. I gotta have somebody to tag on LinkedIn, you know? Give the, name a [00:46:00] family member, somebody

Srishti: I don't-- Oh my God, I can't think about it. I can't... I...

Daniel: keeps you up at night now? This is what

stresses 

Srishti: This, question will keep me up.

Daniel: out? Yeah

Srishti: Uh, my agencies inspire me.

Daniel: That's the right answer.

Srishti: There you go

Daniel: great. That's amazing. Before we, uh, wrap up here, is there any action you would like, folks, any new menu items, anything you want people to check out about Dave's Hot Chicken if they, uh, if they have not already?

Srishti: We've got something really cool launching on July 1st. It is...

Daniel: on July 1st

Srishti: Yeah, I don't know if this is before that or after that, but if it's after, I can tell you what it is. If it's before, I can't

Daniel: Uh, what's today's date?

Srishti: Uh, 9th June, so one month

Daniel: be, it'll be close. You wanna, do you wanna say it and I'll make sure to do it after the first?

Srishti: Y- yeah, you can do it up, you can do it anytime after. So we're doing our first ever, uh, collab with Marvel for X-Men '97. Like, here's Storm in all [00:47:00] her glory. You're not looking

Daniel: I'm writing it down so I don't mess this up. Oh, there we go. We're back. I didn't wanna ruin the news and accidentally forget to post this after July 1st. I'd get a, a cease and desist from the, uh, the Dave's

Srishti: From Marvel? Yeah. Look, it says Dave's Hot Chicken on it. I don't think you... Oh.

Daniel: Yeah, now I can... Yeah, yeah. Oh, that's awesome

Srishti: yeah, so we're doing our first ever, uh, collab for X-Men '97 season two, and it is beyond exciting, 'cause I'm the biggest X-Men fan, so I feel like I have a lot of, like, excitement around this. And, like, so we're gonna do... And it's assuming, like-

Daniel: Oh, that's awesome

Srishti: Yeah.

So I'm super-duper excited about that

Daniel: Amazing. Well then I will make sure to not speak of this until, uh, July 1st. So this was awesome. Thank you so much for joining, especially on your first podcast and, uh,

Srishti: No, thank you for having me

Daniel: we will, we will chat with you soon. Everybody go eat Dave's Hot Chicken [00:48:00]